by Kevin Alfred Strom
THE PARTICIPANTS in the historic discussion you’re about to hear are Sheila Stewart and Barry Saunders of WQOK in Raleigh, North Carolina, Ray Muhammad of the Nation of Islam, and William White Williams (pictured) of the National Alliance.
The discussion took place in October, 1995 — twenty years ago — on the eve of the Nation of Islam-sponsored “Million Man March” of Blacks on Washington. At the time, Mr. Williams — now the Chairman of the National Alliance — was a regional coordinator for the Alliance and was well-known in his community as an outspoken advocate for White interests. So it’s not surprising that Barry Saunders, an integrationist Black columnist for the big newspaper in town and producer of an interview program, went to Will for the White point of view.
Originally, he asked Mr. Williams to come on to debate a representative of the tired old NAACP — an offer which Will politely declined. He would, however, consider a debate with a leader of the group sponsoring the march: Louis Farrakhan’s Nation of Islam, widely known for their Black racial separatist and Jew-aware views. Will called me at the Alliance’s National Office and we both conferred with Dr. Pierce on strategy.
When Mr. Williams arrived at the station at the appointed time, the station was locked up tight and the business offices were closed, with no way to get in except by using a magnetic card reader. Will had not been provided with a card, and no one had been sent down to greet him or let him in. Taking a page out of Sam Spade’s notebook, Will patiently waited until an employee exited the door and then entered just as he was leaving, before the door swung shut. He found the studio, and took his seat a few minutes after the program had begun.
What transpired then can be fairly described as a Jewish media controller’s worst nightmare: Two nationalists of different races agreeing on the importance of racial separation, the evils of integration and miscegenation, and the dangers posed by Jewish media control. And all along, even the nominally integrationist Blacks hosting the show — totally unlike the Jews’ highly-paid attack dogs on the national networks — actually allow free speech and open discussion. Let’s listen in to some excerpts from that program right now:
* * *
Stewart: Our special in-studio guests are Brother Ray Muhammad of the Nation of Islam, and also Will Williams of the National Alliance. Will will tell us about his group. Some African-Americans think this group, the National Alliance, is a White hate group. Do you want to make that correction right now? I’ll give you the perfect opportunity to do so. Okay?
Will Williams: I appreciate that, Sheila. We’re not a “hate group” at all.
Stewart: What are you?
Will Williams: We’re actually the counterpart of Mr. Muhammad’s group, the Nation of Islam — the National Alliance is a pro-White group. We deal with White audiences. This is quite an opportunity to deal with your audience.
Stewart: And exactly how do you deal with the White audience? What do you talk about?
Will Williams: You’re asking me what we believe. I’ve got this little business card that says exactly what we believe in a nutshell. I’ll read it to you.
Will Williams: [reading] “We believe: that the future is what we make it; that we have a responsibility for the racial quality of the coming generations of our people; that no multi-racial society is a healthy society; that if the White race is to survive we must unite our people on the basis of common blood, organize them within a progressive social order, and inspire them with a common set of ideals; that the time to begin is now.”
Stewart: Okay. Barry?
Saunders: Mr. Williams, I don’t see any indication that the White race isn’t surviving. Do you see any indication that that is the case?
Will Williams: Well, according to the News and Observer we’re doing quite well and we’ve got superpowers all over the world that are White, but overall worldwide the White race has slipped to under 10 per cent. of the world’s population.
[. . .]
Will Williams: We look to Nature for our spirituality. And we see ourselves as engaged in biological struggle — with the races as different subspecies in Nature.
I’ve read a little bit about the Nation of Islam. And I read your promo for this march [the “Million Man March], and I have to agree with every word of it. Minister Farrakhan is giving self-respect to his people, and self-reliance, and so forth.
Stewart: Okay, we’re going to take another call now. This is Focus Live. Your question or comment, please.
Caller 1: This is Danny Proctor, Franklinville, North Carolina. You’re talking about the Million Man Black march in Washington, DC October 16th. I was wondering when the Black man and the White man are going to get together and understand that it’s not our problem — it’s a Jewish problem. Jews make up just two per cent. of the population of the United States, yet there are two on the Supreme Court and we’ve got 47 in the Clinton administration. And I am wondering — when are we going to get together and figure out the real problem? The real problem is not between the Black man and the White man. The real problem is the Jews. Now I understand that Mr. Farrakhan understands this fact. So I would like to hear your viewpoint on the Jewish problem in the United States of America.
Stewart: We thank you for calling, sir.
Saunders: I don’t know if we ought to thank that guy or not. Brother Muhammad, would you like to comment on anything this guy said? If you don’t, I really understand…
Muhammad: Well, I would have to say that from our basic perspective that there’s roughly 85 per cent. of the population of planet Earth that has no idea what’s going on. And then you have a group of ten per cent. who understand the dynamics of what’s happening and they’re in a position of power — they have a platform that permits them to be able to manipulate and control. And then you have a five per cent. group that are striving the raise the level of consciousness of the rest of humanity, I should say that 85 per cent.
[. . .]
Caller 2: Why does it always seem like White America is threatened when Black men seem to be able to get together in unity and strength and take a stand? I just want to ask the question — why does White America seem to be so threatened with that?
Stewart: Thank you for calling, Pam.
Saunders: Will, are White men threatened by this march at all?
Will Williams: This White man’s not threatened. I’m all for the march. We’re not calling for a march of our own: We don’t have a million White men with enough backbone to get away from the TV on that day.
Stewart: So, Will, will you be there? Are you planning to go to DC?
Will Williams: No, I’m not. Like I said, I usually just deal with the people who are attracted to us. I’ve got my hands full. I would like to make a comment.
Will Williams: A couple of callers back Mr. Proctor mentioned the Jewish aspect, and we kind of glazed over that. If people will write to my address, I will send them Who Rules America?, which is a tract exposing the Jewish control of our media — something Mr. Farrakhan is quite well aware of — like the recent acquisition by Time Warner of Ted Turner’s [CNN] network. Up ’til then, when we’d say there’s Jewish control of the media, they’d say “Well, are you telling us Ted Turner is Jewish?” We’d say “No, but Gerald Levin is Jewish — and so is Steve Ross, the man before him.” It’s always in Jewish hands, and we need to address that.
Will Williams: I see Mr. Muhammad as a fellow nationalist. This is a balanced show with two nationalists and two integrationists. And I’d like to know your opinion of that. Nationalism is what can save our people — both of our peoples.
Saunders: Okay, but Mr. Williams, on this card for the National Alliance you say that “no multiracial society is a healthy society.” What does that mean — that society should only have one race? What exactly do you mean by that?
Will Williams: That means we’re separatists. Are you separatists? [addressing Mr. Muhammad]
Muhammad: We definitely believe that, amongst ourselves, among our own.
Will Williams: Well, that’s the way we feel. Now that’s not “hate,” is it?
Muhammad: No. You mentioned earlier studying Nature, and that you get your guidance from Nature. We too get our guidance from Nature. When we look into Nature we see that you never have a chimpanzee and a gorilla mate — you don’t have an orangutan and a squirrel come together. You see that cats are all in the cat family, but you never see a lion and a domestic cat…
Will Williams: In Idaho, they just killed some lions and some tigers — and some crosses of lions and tigers. I’d never heard of that — but it is only when man domesticates these beasts that this happens.
Muhammad: But that’s unnatural.
Will Williams: That’s right. I’ll try to clear up one thing: We’ve been called “White supremacists.” And we’re not supremacists. We’d don’t want to be “supreme” over anybody. We want to be separate. If you go back to segregation, now that’s supremacy.
Stewart: But Will, when you have a quote that says “White order” or White… what does that card say again, Barry?
Saunders: “If the White race is to survive, we must unite our people on the basis of common blood…”
Stewart: So, when you hear something like that, what else can African-Americans think but that you’re a White hate group? You know?
Will Williams: Mr. Muhammad, don’t you advocate the same thing? Uniting, based on common blood?
Muhammad: We most definitely advocate that.
Will Williams: We’re in agreement, then. Just like I said — we have nationalism versus the internationalism of the Jews, the “New World Order” that’s represented by Mr. Bush, Mr. Clinton, all these guys — these White guys that are supposedly “White leaders,” but they don’t represent me. They are internationalists. What we need is nationalism. And we’re willing to work with Black separatists. But we’re not going to be called “haters” and deal with people who call us haters.
Muhammad: Each entity or grouping has its order and its place in God’s creation. I just want to say this for the theological thinkers out there. We’re taught that in the latter days that the kingdom of God would be established on Earth. And what we need to look for and understand is that it will not be a democratic form of government. It won’t be a republican form of government. It won’t be a communistic form of government. What it will actually be is a theocracy — a governmental structure set up by God himself.
Saunders: I tell you what, my head is spinning over this unlikely alliance between Mr. Williams and Brother Muhammad.
Stewart: You’re not alone.
Saunders: Brother Muhammad, though, is there any difference between what you guys think and what Mr. Williams’ group is espousing?
Muhammad: The general principle of separation — I think that stands for itself.
Saunders: Now Mr. Williams, we want to be fair here, so — we’ve allowed Brother Muhammad to give out his phone number, so you wanted to give out your phone number and address for the National Alliance.
Stewart: So people can know what the National Alliance is all about.
Will Williams: Our National Office can be reached at [updated 2015 contact information; PO Box 172, Laurel Bloomery TN 37680 USA; http://natall.com/ — Ed. ]
Saunders: How many members are there in the National Alliance?
Will Williams: That number’s not for public consumption, but we’re growing pretty rapidly.
Stewart: You’re a public group, though, aren’t you?
Will Williams: Yes. We’re denied the tax exempt status that all of you enjoy with your groups — but that’s the government for you. The government doesn’t want anybody to know we even exist. Let me also give you our World Wide Web address on the Internet: http://natvan.com/ — so people out there with computers can look us up.
Stewart: Okay, all right. We’ll give that address out again later in the program.
Saunders: There’s a lot of love in this room, ladies and gentlemen —
Stewart: Lots of love…
Saunders: A lot of love between Will Williams of the National Alliance and Brother Ray Muhammad of the Nation of Islam…
Stewart: I’d say that this is definitely an historic moment.
Will Williams: I saw it as a very positive thing. We have a weekly radio show, and I called our National Office and they sent me a script.
Will Williams: I’d like to read one sentence from it if we have time.
Stewart: One sentence is fine. That’d be fine.
Will Williams: This is from our radio show; just a quote out of the transcript: “Blacks are appalled at the state of their people, and more and more of them are calling for independence and freedom and self-government…”
Stewart: Okay, we’re going to stop you there. Do you think that Blacks are appalled, Brother Muhammad, by the status of their people?
Muhammad: We are saying that we are in a deplorable condition right now.
[. . .]
Saunders: I’d like to thank you for coming, Brother Muhammad. And I’d like to thank you for coming. When I talked to you, Will, on Friday you were forceful about your viewpoint. Today, when you didn’t show up — I’m sitting here looking at an empty chair — and I thought you’d punked out on me. But it’s good to see you here.
Stewart: It is very good. Thank you.
Saunders: I’m glad Brother Muhammad is here also. I think this was a very edifying show and I hope we can do it again — get both of you guys on here.
Will Williams: Have I got time to read one more sentence…
Stewart: No, we’re about out of time.
Saunders: We’re not recruiting for the National Alliance…
Stewart: We can’t recruit for the National Alliance.
Will Williams: …because we are looking at the world from the same viewpoint.
Saunders: Maybe you all can exchange cards or phone numbers…
Stewart: …after the show. Okay.
Will Williams: I appreciate your being objective and fair.
Stewart: You’re quite welcome. Thank you.
* * *
The program we’ve just heard can teach us many things. It teaches us that, even in an age of mass media control, there are venues where our voice can be heard by thousands of people — if we have the competence and the energy to speak out convincingly and boldly.
It teaches us that we can reach a modus vivendi with members of other races who genuinely want self-determination for their own people.
It teaches us that many millions across this continent and the globe are aware of the dangers of Jewish media control and Jewish multiracialism.
It teaches us also that we have a long way to go, and the time we now have for rescuing our people from certain death is much, much shorter than it was when this interview was recorded 20 years ago. The Blacks may have many social problems and areas of profound inferiority compared to our own folk, but they are light years ahead of us in racial loyalty.
It is incumbent on all of us who are racially conscious White men and women to reach out to others — tell them about the National Alliance, encourage them to join, and redouble our own financial support for the Alliance.
Stop waiting for someone else to do what must be done. Stop waiting for someone else to make that “big donation” that will make our future assured. Don’t just read our articles and make occasional comments any more. We need more than that to implement our program. We need men and women to join us and put their shoulders to the wheel. We need people who will give it all they’ve got, heart and soul. We need men and women who will give till it hurts and then give some more. We need you to stop being a spectator and take part in making a new future for our people. If you share that vision — that forward vision of an entirely new society, based on race, that we must have — then I want you to join us, today.
* * *
You’ve been listening to American Dissident Voices, the radio program of the National Alliance. I want to send each of you our beautiful, full-color illustrated booklet explaining the purpose of the Alliance. In this booklet you can read about our program to save our race and secure a future for White children. It is entitled Building a New White World — to receive your copy, simply visit natall.com/booklet or send $3 to National Alliance, Box 172, Laurel Bloomery, TN 37680 USA. Once again, that’s $3 to Box 172, Laurel Bloomery, TN 37680 USA. We’re on the air every week — and our news site is updated many times every day — at nationalvanguard.org. We also have a forum where you can meet, talk, learn, and share with others — whitebiocentrism.com. Until next week, this is Kevin Alfred Strom reminding you to keep on thinking free.Listen to the broadcast